Fr Anthony Doe was the guest speaker for the Conference of the Association of Priests for the Gospel of Life today at the London Oratory. He spoke about the Gospel of Life in relation to the spiritual life of the priest, encouraging us to find in contemplative prayer the love of the Father which brings fruitfulness to the celibate life.One of Fr Doe's memorable phrases was to describe contraception as a "faith killer". Within a generation or two, the faith dies away in many families as a result of the use of contraception owing to the collective rejection of the proper ordering of love.
In the afternoon, Fr Marcus Holden gave a short spiritual conference followed by half an hour's adoration (with confessions) and benediction. Fr Holden spoke about the fear of God in relation to the spiritual life of the priest. His conference drew from the teaching of the Fathers of the Church, especially St Basil and St John Chrysostom, and the teaching of St Alphonsus Liguori.
As ever, the Society for the Protection of Unborn Children were most helpful in their assistance at the conference. It was good to talk to John Smeaton afterwards about the current situation in the UK, especially with the ghastly Human Tissue and Embryology Bill coming before us.
34 comments:
Sure it is in some circumstances a 'faith killer' but all those contracepting in my very large,wider family still go to Mass & avail themselves of the sacraments. Fortunately for my husband & i we haven't contracepted for 21 years & have a strong faith but i wouldn't say that all those people at Mass on Sunday week in week out have no faith although it's obvious they contracept. i do think the Priests need to remind people in that situation to examine their consciences..but i'm not sure entirely i agree...why are our church's full? & they are..
That contraception is a `Faith Killer` is so evident that it can hardly be questioned. The issue of contraception and Vatican II came at the same time and modernists found it easy to say that if the Church was wrong on this then they could be wrong in everything else. A leading Catholic Journalst recently wrote in a Catholic Newspaper that the Pope was infallible in Faith but not in questions of morals. To my surprise there were no replies. To be honest at the time of Humanae Vitae there were not real developments in Natural Family Planning and it was very difficult for many catholics. We now have the evidence that the Church was right but the relaxing of morals means few catholics are listening.
Not only a faith killer but a killer of marriage, fidelity, chastity, dignity, family and most of all a killer of romance and true love!
What's wrong with the world? In a nutshell the fact that contraception has removed the procreative from the unitive aspects of human love and reduced human beings to mere objects of sexual self-gratification.
When contraception fails - as it invariably does - the abortion industry comes to the 'rescue'. Sick isn't it - how cheap human dignity and life in our so-called civilized society.
There really should be something done to mark 40 years since Humanae Vitae - next year. The priests for life in America are doing something. Are the bishops going to co-ordinate something?
Dominie
Those catholics that contracept and 'avail themselves of the sacraments', presumably meaning of course Holy Communion, are committing a grievous sacrilege.
Church teaching is perfectly clear on this issue - sadly formation in the vast majority of church pews is anything but perfectly clear!
How can people examine their consciences if those same consciences have no formation. Yes Jackie - our churches are full, but sadly many of these people are of the 'pick'n-choose' variety catholics - 'woolly, kum-ba-ya, feel good, page-3 reading, handshaking sign of peace lukewarm faith types' who form queues a mile long to get to Holy Communion - yet haven't seen the inside of a confessional for years! Somebody ought to tell them.....
Well yes we should tell them george..but our Church has none of that trendy stuff you're on about..i do often glance up at the long lines for Holy communion & wonder if they've all confessed. Availing themselves of the sacraments meant my parents never received Holy Communion for years even though the trendy Priest told them that they were free to do so even if on the pill. They obviously knew better.
Fr Guy always insists the children go to confession before Mass & perhaps the tide will turn. But John what i'm saying is i don't think judging by the numbers at Sunday Mass that the faith is being lost. OK not everyone has the expert formation that we have but i ain't about to judge who can & can't receive Our Lord.
i think the time is ripe anyway to introduce cathechism for adults..we've had considerable success in our Parent's Talks..better to light a candle..
Well, there are plenty of Protestants out there with "faith", but they preach abortion is ok, contraception is ok, same sex "marriage" is ok, IVF treatment is OK and so on. What needs to be considered is whether Jesus really will find any faith on this earth when He comes again, and where will that faith be found? in the teachings of the Catholic Church, but people don't want to believe that, especially in this Ecumenical day and age when there's apparently no difference in faith between us and our Protestant/Anglican "brethren". Our supposedly Catholic liturgy has been so Protestantised in some places, that it's no wonder that the people in the pews every Sunday (as long as it doesn't clash with little Johnny's Sunday morning football league, but then Father did say it's ok if something important keeps us from getting to Mass on a Sunday) haven't really got true Faith, and so the contracepting carries on... and are the churches really all that full, considering that it is God Almighty Himself who comes onto our altars?????
Good stuff. Shame that some other priests don't follow the Church's teaching on contraception...
I heard Father Paul Marx give an anti-contraception homily at Sacred Heart Cathedral in Raleigh North Carolina many years ago. Boy was the bishop furious!
Do you think you can really preach it from the pulpit? Or do you think people need so much catechization in why we should believe in the Church and what She tells us that it backfires?
Have you ever preached such a homily or touched on the subject in one?
Sadly many of those sitting in the pews have been led astray by the shepherd who should feed and guard them. My parish priest told me to contracept when the Natural Family Planning method I was using resulted in an unplanned pregnancy. Like most parishioners I trusted my him. I went regularly to confession and Holy Communion. Years later while studying for a degree in Catholic Theology I recognised the error of this advice and wept bitterly. By God's grace I am now in a position in a parish to teach the beauty of Humanae Vitae in all its fullness and work with Fr Anthony in this area. It is the pastors and shepherds who we must pray for, that they will have the courage and conviction to catechise and feed the flock in their care.
Fr. Tim,
“Within a generation or two, the faith dies away in many families as a result of the use of contraception owing to the collective rejection of the proper ordering of love.” I wholeheartedly agree.
But this is only one of several faith-destroying effects of contraception. My impression is that Catholic parents who defy the Church’s teachings on this matter “neuter” their own ability to pass on the faith to their children by virtue of their negative witness and the resultant state of permanent semi-detachment from Catholicism within their families.
I personally rate the scandal and open defiance factors as being even more destructive than the more subtle long-term effect of contraception that Fr. Doe was referring to.
It makes me very sad when I see the completely superficial way the majority of my Catholic friends and relations live out (or rather fail to live out) their faith, and the root cause seems invariably to be the exemption they have granted themselves from the Church’s recent teachings on sexuality. I would not be surprised if this is the biggest single cause of the malaise of sluggishness and lukewarmness manifested by the majority of practising Catholic adults.
Jeff - preaching on such a subject at Sunday Mass is difficult because the priest must keep within the bounds of what it is suitable for children to hear. But yes, I often refer to Humanae Vitae and the Church's teaching. Some people listen sometimes :-) Another approach is to speak about the subject and have some of the CTS leaflets at the back of the Church for the adults to take home. Also, the parish can arrange talks for people outside of Mass.
Jackie - the "numbers at Mass" have fallen steeply over the past 30 years and are still rapidly falling in many places: slightly masked by the influx of Poles and others. It is a very common pattern that teenagers lapse from the faith. This pattern is avoided most effectively (not always, of course) by families who follow the Church's teaching.
So many people do not realise that many forms of contraception do not prevent conception but actually often act as an early method of abortion. In addition the contraceptive mentality often leads to a coarsening of conscience. So many people in our society condone ( "I don't see anything wrong in it. I'm not doing any harm to anyone.") sexual activity outside of marriage - providing contraceptives are used. Pope Paul VI rightly predicted an acceptance of contraception leads to "a lowering of moral standards" (Humanae Vitae n. 17). Peter Hebblethwaite (no fan of the papacy)wrote in his bigraphy of Paul VI: "It has also been remarked that once the link between the procreative and unitive goals of marriage has been broken it becomes more diffficult to condemn buggery or bestiality" (Paul VI: The First Modern Pope, HarperCollins, 1993 ISBN 0 00 215658 x, page 8)
i hear what you say Fr..but none of us lapsed although there was plenty of contraception around..on this particular day of All Souls all my Irish relatives..uncles,aunts,cousins,grand-parents all received the sacraments particularly that of extreme unction. Looking back my parents can see the value of humanae Vitae..& have repented & are great Catholic witnesses.
& by God's grace i was able to embrace Humanae Vitae with open arms.
It must just be me but any Mass i've been to on a Sunday is over-flowing & not just the Oratory.
Jackie - sorry to insist on the bad news but this is not simply a matter of feeling or perception.
Figures from the Bishops' Conference website for Sunday Mass attendance:
1988: 1,385,408
2005: 958,541
a drop of over 30%.
What arguments would you use, Father, to defend the Church's teaching on contraception against those who support 'birth control' as a means to 'reduce the carbon footprint' and 'save the planet'? This sinister undercurrent to the Green agenda will become an increasingly prominent issue, I think.
Father ~ why did Basil Hume tell John-Paul that all was well within the Church in England. these figures look dreadful.
Oh! That's pretty depressing!
You are right father.
But I read Jackie's deeper point as being that the statistics conceal as much as they reveal.
It seems obvious to me that there is a deepening of faith going on in the Catholic Church and that that is resulting in more and more young people returning to orthodox belief and practice.
Overall, numbers may still be going down in many places. But the trend of spiritual health in the Church is going up, up, up. I came into the Church in the early eighties and the difference! Simply astonishing.
It's enough to make a Catholic out of you.
And after all, the existence of good, sound priests like yourself is just one proof of what I am saying. You never found them twenty years ago. Now they are everywhere, overwhelming the poor modernists running the seminaries.
not simply a matter of feeling or perception.
Figures from the Bishops' Conference website for Sunday Mass attendance:
1988: 1,385,408
2005: 958,541
a drop of over 30%.
Yes, but what evidence is there that this drop is because of contraception rather than a host of other things such as clap clap gloria and Kumbyah?
Just about all institutional activities from scout membership to political party membership have similarly declined over the last 40 years. Compare attendance at Charlton Athletic football matches today with crowds 50 years ago and you will see a similar fall. Unfortunately there is an awful lot more choice in what to do in your free time these days.
Also how does one broach the subject to a couple in a two bedroom house with three children, who is in no position to afford any bigger accomodation?
(yes I know natural family planning is the obvious answer but this is a far bigger cross for the woman - a mans libido is unvaried and he can enjoy sex at any time but many womens libidos fall and rise during the monthly cycle (just like the rest of the animal world) and therefore you are asking them to abstain during the one week where they really do want sex - to the extent where it could be argued that a man insiting on NFP is being selfish.
(BTW I'm not trying to be awkward here its a genuine point)
Have just posted Bishop Vasa's take on contraception..
P - let me just clarify some of the logic here.
I posted those stats because Jackie seemed to be claiming that Mass attendance had not gone down. It has.
I agree that there are various reasons for the drop in Mass attendance. To say "contraception is a faith killer" is not to say that it is the only faith killer. One quite important reason is that people do indeed regard going to Mass as something you might choose to do in your "free time".
The "couple in a two bedroom house etc." asking me what to do doesn't actually come up in pastoral practice. If people believe the teaching they find their own way to live it and make it work.
Couple using NFP are much less affected by arguments about their their "needs" for sex than couples using the pill. Sex used just for recreation becomes a weapon in an artificially exacerbated "war of the sexes." I recommend Janet Smith on the existential consequences of NFP and artificial birth control.
>>P - let me just clarify some of the >>logic here.
>>I posted those stats because Jackie >>seemed to be claiming that Mass >>attendance had not gone down. It has.
sorry - misread your comment
>>I agree that there are various >>reasons for the drop in Mass >>attendance. To say "contraception is >>a faith killer" is not to say that it >>is the only faith killer. One quite >>important reason is that people do >>indeed regard going to Mass as >>something you might choose to do in >>your "free time".
agreed, that is not the correct attitude, but I suspect some people 50 years ago did go to church because: everyone else did, the shops were shut, no internet, test card on TV the pub didn't open till 12 and no money left after Saturday night.
There was still quite a lot of peer presure to conform to norms in those days, one of which was to go to church. Now the peer pressure is the other way and there are a million and one distractions that just did not exist, plus of course the "spirit of vatican 2 abuses" which make attendance something of an ordeal, so a concious decision has to be made to do something which, a generation ago was habit. This is a distillation process which leads to much fewer but more committed attenders, this does not neccesarily mean the church is in a worse state, just that the problem is not masked by large numbers attending without thinking much about why they are and switching off their catholicism as soon as they leave the church.
Also I don't think that there has been a collapse in church attendance - middle class church attendance is still what it was. There has been an utter collapse in working class church attendance - particularly among men.
I suspect that this is partly because instead of being able to silently worship before V2, they are now being forced to shake hands with complete strangers, forced to sing clap clap glorias and watch bossy middle class types on the sanctuary acting as if they are in charge of the priest and have to be sociable and pretend they like everyone - Peter Hitchens recently said as much (about C of E attendance) in his blog or column (cant remember which)
>The "couple in a two bedroom house >etc." asking me what to do doesn't >actually come up in pastoral practice. >If people believe the teaching they >find their own way to live it and make >it work.
Lets be honest, the only solution here is abstinence (and the more difficult the consequences of pregnancy the more careful you have to be so the more abstinence you require) and most people won't ask because they don't want to be told that
>Couple using NFP are much less >affected by arguments about their >their "needs" for sex than couples >using the pill. Sex used just for >recreation becomes a weapon in an >artificially exacerbated "war of the >sexes." I recommend Janet Smith on the >existential consequences of NFP and >artificial birth control.
Will read this, thanks, but it all comes down to this, NFP means abstinence. Full Stop.
I'm not saying that this is wrong, in fact it seems to me to be a noble thing which can gain much grace (just as with other forms of abstinence), but I think it is a bit unfair to label those who are unable to practice such abstinence as being objectively in mortal sin [if they use contraception methods which amount to abortion that is another matter].
It seems a bit like saying its a mortal sin to eat Meat on Friday which is absurd. (which does not mean abstaining from meat on Fridays is not a noble thing that can lead to many graces).
ie: I'm not saying the church is wrong in principle on contraception, but to say married people, who already have several children, and use non abortificent contraceptives, are committing a *mortal* sin and therefore [objectively speaking] will go to hell upon sudden death is something that I think brings the church into disrepute.
It seems to me the ecclesial equivalent of hanging an ten year old for stealing a loaf of bread (as often happened in the UK less than 200 years ago). To say that hanging people for stealing bread is wrong does not mean that you are condoning the stealing of bread, merely that a sense of proportion is needed
Married couples with several children using non abortifient contraception venial yes, but surely mortal is surely going to far?
P - I agree with you about the lack of working class men and the contributory causes. I think you are too negative about the large Mass attendances years ago. People did not simply "switch off" when they left the Church. As recently discussed on this blog, lay associations were thriving; people often really put into practice what they prayed in Church.
On the contraception discussion, many couple re-think their decision about the size of their family and their economic reasons for limiting it, once they have become convinced of the Church's teaching. That is what I meant by saying that "they find their own way to live it."
NFP cannot simply be used as "catholic contraception" because as you rightly say, it involves abstinence. The point of contraception is to be able to have sex without the consequence of children.
The failure rate of artificial contraception ensures that the next moral milestone is the condoning of abortion. The Sisters of the Gospel of Life and the Good Counsel Network will tell of the large proportion of their visitors who are using "contraception."
Mortal/venial sin - the Church has always upheld the principle that on matters of sex, there is nothing minor. It's always important. We might wish it weren't but we can't change nature.
i hear what you say..but all i can say is that the Oratory is packed to capacity 5 Masses on a Sunday. The family Mass mainly working class Ladywood is packed. St Dunstans Kings Heath is packed,Our Lady of Lourdes Yardley Wood is packed as is St Annes. i'm sure St Francis' Handsworth,Holy Name Perry Bar & the Cathedral are packed too.
What i think is that Priests need to preach Humanae Vitae week in week out & that we need ongoing cathechesis. For some reason people are attending Mass & that is something to be thankful for.
Re the type of Mass..many young people prefer a charismatic type of Mass. i know most of your readers are going'oh how awful!' but 'trendy' Masses work for som,e & correctly done Youth 2000 & the like attract thousands of young people.
At the Old Rite Mass yesterday the average age was about 60 so i don't think we're going to see droves of young people despite what everyone is predicting.All the same it is nice to have the choice.
one of my 48 first cousins has always been active in charismatic styles of worship. he runs a weekly prayer group of about 30 young people from his house. He uses a lot of modern technolgy..it's not my 'thing' but he is very successful in bringing young people into the Church. (They have 6 children & he is now 38).
Finally my friend Fr David Keniry runs the Ark of the Covenant diocesan retreat/teaching centre. He is very devoted to Our Lady & is a charismatic Priest who has done a lot to heal the wounded.
When i was younger i remember lots of men standing in the foyer until the final blessing so they could scarper afterwards. Today you're more likely to see people make their thanksgiving. Apologies for rambling on.
Thanks for that Father.
I think we can agree that I am not questioning the churches teaching on contraception, but am questioning the teaching that all sexual matters are serious.
What is the reason and background to this latter teaching, as this has effects far beyond contraception (and combined with the teaching that sex must be ordered to procreation it presumably outlaws married couples undertaking any sexual acts other than vaginal intercourse) [sorry to be explicit].
This is a *very* difficult teaching to accept, let alone follow, and I rather suspect that many catholics do not even know it exists.
I would also say that the present situation where 99.9% of the congregation go to communion whether worthy or not means that it takes a fair bit of courage to sit down and not go to communion and have everyone stare at you because you have decided you are not worthy of communicating, because you stick out like a sore thumb and that can be a powerful incentive to go with the herd.
Jackie - i hear what you say... I was quoting statistics that are provided by the Bishops' Conference. Not an opinion...
I agree that the various new movement and charismatic groups have done great work with young people. They have kept by and large to sound doctrine on faith and morals, and devotion to the Eucharist and Our Lady. What they need now, in many cases, is to understand the nature of the liturgy...
Actually that is meant as a serious point, too. I think that many such groups will indeed come to appreciate the value of traditional liturgy and make the proper distinction between liturgy and popular devotion. The latter can take various forms and they appeal to some young people.
P - It is the teaching of the Church that in matters concerning sexual sin, there is no "light matter". This is because of the link between the sexual drive and human life, and because impure thoughts and actions lead easily to worse sins.
(In marriage, the traditional teaching is that sexual acts between couples that lead to intercourse are licit.)
The Church's teaching on chastity is a difficult teaching to follow, especially today when young people are taught that masturbation is natural and good. Many develop a sexual addiction that is hard to escape. A greater difficulty is provided, especially for young men, by internet pornography which is also itself addictive. Confessors need to be very compassionate and understanding without compromising the teaching of the church or allowing the false idea to creep in that nobody can really change these habits.
By the regular use of confession, prayer and penance many have, by the grace of God, begun to live a chaste life. Some Protestants have also discovered much of Catholic teaching in this area without realising it. (for example, the book "Every Man's Battle".)
With regard to not receiving Communion, I don't think that it is quite as stark as you suggest although it can be embarrassing in some circumstances. But it is better for a person to make a good spiritual communion than for them to go to communion knowing that they should not. I believe that the link between confession and communion is a very helpful way for people to overcome sinful habits.
Thanks Fr Tim! i'm just 'in one'! So now we believe what the Bishop's Conference tells us? We can't have it both ways can we?
Re the man making a spiritual communion..of course that was very common 30 years ago..even as small children, we knew we couldn't all traipse up to Holy communion..it was very common to have 7 & 8 year olds remaining seated..at Communion time...i don't know where this everyone run up for communion came from.
In the Latin High at least it is mentioned that only those in a state of grace should proceed to Communion. As with the HV document i think our Priests should stand at the lectern before Holy Communion & ask people to examine their consciences..had they been recently to confession, were they free from mortal sin ie were they married in the Church,living a pure life of chstity, weren't contracepting??
A lot of sins do seem to be centered around sex & it is only with the acceptance of children, no matter the cost, & being open to life that makes married love licit..etc etc of my soap box again..
Re the type of Mass..many young people prefer a charismatic type of Mass. i know most of your readers are going'oh how awful!' but 'trendy' Masses work for som,e & correctly done Youth 2000 & the like attract thousands of young people.
At the Old Rite Mass yesterday the average age was about 60 so i don't think we're going to see droves of young people despite what everyone is predicting.All the same it is nice to have the choice.
Well I hope you're not speaking for me because I certainly don't prefer a "charismatic" or "trendy" mass - whatever those are and I know hundreds of other people my age who don't either. I have always been suspicious of charismatic theology and their undue emphasis on signs and wonders. Many of them support dubious initiatives such as Medjuorge and 'Life in the Spirit' seminars. That isn't to say that all of them are bad - but it ain't the rosy picture you paint Jackie.
I have been to Youth 2000 before - twice in fact. It does a good job of trying to bring young people to God through the Rosary and Adoration. Their liturgy is a law unto itself however. One is more striking is that the same people turn up at their festivals year in and year out. Only a handful of new people come.
Younger people, indeed younger Catholics, are now starting to get a bit fed up of the patronizing efforts to make the church relevant to them. That is why quite a few probably turn to Eastern mysticism and the occult in the end - its spirituality (however false it is) is undiluted. Couple that with the fact that, Catholic education and catechisis has been a disaster in the last 40 odd years and it is no wonder why communion lines are long and the confessional is hardly frequented. We are living in a disintegrating church. The "springtime renewal" has not taken place, nor will it ever, until people return to tradition.
So now we believe what the Bishop's Conference tells us? We can't have it both ways can we?
Jackie - do you actually believe that the Mass attendance in England and Wales has not gone down?
I quoted the figures from the Bishops' Conference because they were the most "moderate". One set of figures I saw widely quoted claimed that Mass attendance had dropped by 50% in the same period.
The figures are published in the Catholic Directory each year. it is not a happy picture.
But of course, things are not so bad in parishes like the Oratory - for obvious reasons.
This has been a very interesting thread for a bachelor like myself to read.
I don't mean I have been taking a prurient interest !
I simply find it interesting to hear the views of married people.
There must be (I know there are) other men in the world, like myself.
We are not into "a relationship".
We have neither a girl friend, nor for that matter a boy friend.
Oh, we have friends, but that's a different thing.
Teenagers behave like teenagers.
Then we all grow up.
I simply cannot understand what all the fuss is about.
The Church's teaching on sexual behaviour is quite clear.
That teaching is not (in my experience) difficult to accept.
That is because it, to me, makes complete sense.
And it is definitely not a "counsel of perfection".
It is no more difficult to control the sexual appetites than it is to control natural impulses to anger, selfishness, sloth, or whatever.
(When did anyone last read an argument by a Catholic against the Church's teaching on sloth, for instance ?)
Sloth is a besetting sin, and we are all guilty of it from time to time.
So why is it difficult to keep to the teaching on sex ?
What's the difference ?
Temptation is temptation.
And why are there Catholics who feel it necessary publicly to argue with and criticise the teaching of the Church in this one particular area, where they seem docilely to accept the teaching of the Church in every other area of faith and morals ?
I honestly wish some practising Catholic who feels strongly in the matter would be kind enough to explain it to me.
I have been a Catholic Charismatic since 1968, but not to a prayer meeting for decades, because it got to be very trite. It's hard to argue against exuberant praise, because obviously the psalms (now-most ironically imho- said sotto voce by priests all over the world as part of the Church's liturgy) were- some of them- obviously very exuberant, joyful and loud in their rendition. David dancing half naked before the ark obviously makes the point that liturgy has wider possibilities than many would like to acknowledge, but the same loud and praisefilled liturgy week after week, year after year does not answer to the whole spectrum of the soul's needs. If the psalms are a gymnasium for the soul the soul is not going to get the full workout w/o the penitential psalms, for example. My experience was that we Charismatics did not know what to do with Lent, with Advent. Praise and nothing but praise got boring after a while, and unreal.
Neverthless it needs to be said that the Charismatic Renewal enjoys the full approbation of Rome and its basic theology finds plenty of support in St. Thomas Aquinas. The essential problem is that since our awareness of the charismatic gifts came from Pentecostal sources, we absorbed much of their liturgical culture as well. So it is as Fr. Tim said, the Charismatics need to be brought up to speed with the liturgical life of the Church. They need a much fuller catechesis all the way round, and especially an exposure to the lives of the saints- many of whom were charismatics themselves. When these things happen- watch out!
i believe what you say about falling attendances Fr..do you think in the past some went 'out of habit' rather than choice?
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